# EL panel negative zone
**URL:** https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/t/el-panel-negative-zone/14425
**Category:** Core Electronics
**Created:** [24 June 2022 06:42 UTC](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/t/el-panel-negative-zone/14425 "2022-06-24T06:42:16Z")
**Posts on this page:** 13
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Omri204732](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/u/Omri204732)
#### Post date: [24 June 2022 06:42 UTC](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/t/el-panel-negative-zone/14425/1 "2022-06-24T06:42:16Z")
Hello,
Need help regarding reducing the electrode negative zone in my EL panel. I’m creating an EL panel that will illuminate fully (using a 5 seconds sequence) and the frame around the design will not illuminate because of the amount of LEDs that are being used.
Images:
the design (35.5" x 15.75"/ 90 x 40cm):
> **[90x40 — Postimages](https://postimg.cc/CZVLRP50)**
the negative:
> **[BFB303 AD 4 A2 D882 C 9 AA44 A62 — Postimages](https://postimg.cc/9r3GL1wR)**
I wonder if anyone knows how to reduce that green zone. the goal is to make the entire panel illuminate.
Thank you
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### Author:  [@Liam120347](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/u/Liam120347)
#### Post date: [24 June 2022 08:30 UTC](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/t/el-panel-negative-zone/14425/2 "2022-06-24T08:30:32Z")
Hi Omri,
Just to confirm were you fabricating your own pure EL panel? the mention of LED’s muddies the water a little.
Designing an EL panel might be a bit eccentric, [I did find this interesting article on making your own EL panel](https://www.fetchmodus.org/projects/el/index.html), Given the process if you are designing a PCB for it to be grafted onto you might be able to paint the conductor around the edge of the PCB.
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### Author:  [@Omri204732](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/u/Omri204732)
#### Post date: [24 June 2022 08:34 UTC](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/t/el-panel-negative-zone/14425/3 "2022-06-24T08:34:07Z")
Hi Liam,
Thanks for the reply and for sharing the guide! I work with a Chinese supplier and they create it. I’ll be fully honest - I’m not from this industry so I’m not familiar with the terms you used. Maybe I used the wrong when I wrote “LED”, what I meant is the lights of the panel.
The negative zone is mandatory and I wish to eliminate it, and I wonder if I can find a solution and forward it to them.
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### Author:  [@Liam120347](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/u/Liam120347)
#### Post date: [24 June 2022 08:39 UTC](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/t/el-panel-negative-zone/14425/4 "2022-06-24T08:39:42Z")
Hi Omri,
Are you able to put a front plate over the panel? Usually you can use a mask to cover the edges.
Most fab houses usually have a ‘capabilities’ section on the website, would it be possible to send through a link for a quick look(if available)?
I’d definitely have a read-up on how EL panels work, once you understand a process/system it will be much easier to explain what you’d like done
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### Author:  [@Omri204732](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/u/Omri204732)
#### Post date: [24 June 2022 08:55 UTC](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/t/el-panel-negative-zone/14425/5 "2022-06-24T08:55:01Z")
Hi Liam,
Thanks for the super quick reply!
Here’s a design that is fully illuminated for reference -
dragon design: [negative zone and dragon — Postimages](https://postimg.cc/V54tSLvK)
[Screenshot 2022 06 24 at 11 53 36 — Postimages](https://postimg.cc/DSY0F8CX)
You can see the negative zone around the design printed on the panel remains dark in the sequences.
Here’s what part of it looks like in Photoshop:
> **[Screenshot 2022 06 24 at 11 50 42 — Postimages](https://postimg.cc/z3RBNzWL)**
> **[Screenshot 2022 06 24 at 11 52 19 — Postimages](https://postimg.cc/phLsjcf7)**
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### Author:  [@Omri204732](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/u/Omri204732)
#### Post date: [27 June 2022 15:24 UTC](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/t/el-panel-negative-zone/14425/6 "2022-06-27T15:24:55Z")
Hi Liam,
Just checking in to see if you checked my last message
cheers!
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### Author:  [@Omri204732](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/u/Omri204732)
#### Post date: [27 June 2022 22:12 UTC](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/t/el-panel-negative-zone/14425/7 "2022-06-27T22:12:30Z")
guys,
is there an easy way to decrease the electrode negative zone in this EL panel?
The illuminated design:
> **[negative zone and dragon — Postimages](https://postimg.cc/V54tSLvK)**
The negative zone around it:
> **[Screenshot 2022 06 24 at 11 53 36 — Postimages](https://postimg.cc/DSY0F8CX)**
The electrode negative zone frame around the design:
> **[BFB303 AD 4 A2 D882 C 9 AA44 A62 — Postimages](https://postimg.cc/9r3GL1wR)**
The goal is to reduce the negative electrodes so the design of this dragon will be completely illuminated instead of only 95%.
dragon design:
> **[dragon el — Postimages](https://postimg.cc/BtRLDz7t)**
Cheers,
Omri
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### Author:  [@Liam](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/u/Liam)
#### Post date: [27 June 2022 23:44 UTC](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/t/el-panel-negative-zone/14425/8 "2022-06-27T23:44:23Z")
Hi Omri,
Very interesting project!!
Unfortunately the answer will most likely be probably not, the negative zone is to tie the front conductive plane of the EL panel to ground.
I’d get in touch with your supplier to see if any past jobs may have experimented with a technique like this!
As for alternatives, Kindles use a light guide to push light onto the front face: [How the Kindle Paperwhite Works - Graphic - NYTimes.com](https://archive.nytimes.com/www.nytimes.com/interactive/2012/12/26/technology/light-reading.html#:~:text=The%20Kindle%20Paperwhite%20uses%20a,the%20surface%20of%20the%20display).
Would something like that work?
Liam
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### Author:  [@Omri204732](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/u/Omri204732)
#### Post date: [28 June 2022 09:09 UTC](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/t/el-panel-negative-zone/14425/9 "2022-06-28T09:09:57Z")
Hey Liam,
Thank you for the quick reply!
I already asked the supplier and using the electrodes under the panel is the only way to achieve the final product. Sadly, the kindle paperwhite will not be suitable for this project.
Do you think it is mandatory to have the negative electrodes located around the design or could I condense them in 1 other spot instead? I apologize if it sounds silly haha
also, I guess if I keep the dragon itself illuminated, but not the entire design, the negative electrode zones will not be an issue, for they will mix nicely with the dark parts of the design.
I also have an issue with the life span of the panel which as of now, is only 2000 - 4000 hours. would you recommend reducing the number of illuminated parts in the design in order to increase the life span of the panel?
|
Thanks again!
Omri
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### Author:  [@Liam120347](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/u/Liam120347)
#### Post date: [28 June 2022 09:58 UTC](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/t/el-panel-negative-zone/14425/10 "2022-06-28T09:58:13Z")
Hi Omri,
I’m not too certain about the electrodes being around the outside - if your fab allows it I guess it should keep the whole panel illuminated (I’d see if there are any consultants at the fab that you could bounce questions off of that have experience in designing different panels).
I’m not too certain what you might be able to do to increase the lifespan - I’m just having a look around Google to find good info/intuition.
> [@Liam](#):
>
> As for alternatives, Kindles use a light guide to push light onto the front face: [How the Kindle Paperwhite Works - Graphic - NYTimes.com](https://archive.nytimes.com/www.nytimes.com/interactive/2012/12/26/technology/light-reading.html#:~:text=The%20Kindle%20Paperwhite%20uses%20a,the%20surface%20of%20the%20display).
@Liam that looks very interesting! Just curious, how come you couldn’t use the lightguide to light it up? Usually LEDs have a longer lifespan and are easy to replace!
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### Author:  [@Omri204732](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/u/Omri204732)
#### Post date: [28 June 2022 15:35 UTC](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/t/el-panel-negative-zone/14425/11 "2022-06-28T15:35:55Z")
Hi Liam,
Thanks again for the reply and the tips! I will add some more parts to the panel ( a bit complicated) which will prevent me from replacing it with LED lights. I know it would be a good alternative but the final product would not work without the additional parts.
Off the top of your head, do you think it will be possible to move the negative electrodes to a different part instead of the frame?
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### Author:  [@Liam120347](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/u/Liam120347)
#### Post date: [28 June 2022 23:23 UTC](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/t/el-panel-negative-zone/14425/12 "2022-06-28T23:23:39Z")
Hi Omri,
I’d imagine moving the negative electrode is fine although you’ll still need the blue insulation strip.
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### Author:  [@Omri204732](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/u/Omri204732)
#### Post date: [29 June 2022 08:19 UTC](https://forum.core-electronics.com.au/t/el-panel-negative-zone/14425/13 "2022-06-29T08:19:39Z")
Hi Liam,
Thanks for the feedback! I will ask the supplier about it. I really appreciate all the help 😃